Izrael

[Barak]

Objavil-a 1knap

KONTRA KONTRA KONTRA nekaj kar nočeš videt

Kontra na kaj že???

[Barak]

Malo branja, da si eni malo razširite obzorja svojih "analitskih sposbnosti" glede stanja na bv!!



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The traditional view of the Arab-Israeli conflict is of Jews fighting Muslims. But that image does not always reflect the truth.

In fact, there are thousands of Muslim Bedouin who serve in the Israeli army, or IDF, and even bear arms against their fellow Muslims in the occupied West Bank and Gaza.

They do so although it is not compulsory for them to serve in the Israeli military, as it is for most Israeli Jews, and sometimes military service comes with a price tag.

"I will do whatever is required from me to do the job with the full faith in the service of the Israeli state," asserts Maj Fehd Fallah, a Bedouin from the village of Saad in the Israeli occupied Golan.

He is happy to perform his duty, whoever he may have to fight against.



Bedouin have fought and died alongside Jewish Israelis in the army
"Yes, I have fought against Muslims in Gaza," he says. That includes Israel's three-week Operation Cast Lead which began in December last year.

"And I would fight again if I had to," he added. "Israeli Muslims who don't serve in the IDF should be ashamed for not serving their country."

Israel's Bedouin are a Muslim, Arabic-speaking group. Although these formerly nomadic people were once considered part of the Palestinian nation, most of them are now proud to call themselves Israelis.

Co-operation between Jews and Bedouin began before the establishment of the Israeli state in 1948.

In 1946, tribal leader Abu Yusuf al-Heib sent more than 60 of his men to fight alongside Zionist forces against their Arab neighbours in Galilee.

More than 60 years on, Maj Fallah's devotion to the Jewish state was unequivocal. He even refused to be interviewed by me in Arabic, insisting: "I have better command of Hebrew."

Military service is a family tradition in many Bedouin villages, especially those located in the north of Israel.

During my conversation with Maj Fallah, two men were standing listening to us. They were his cousins and both wore the uniform of the IDF.

"It's a legacy - it's something that has been passed on from generation to generation in my family," Maj Fallah explains.

"My father and his father served in the army too."

Potential conflict

The Israeli army does not publish statistics about the exact number of non-Jewish enlisted soldiers, although it says hundreds of non-Jewish Israeli citizens - Muslims, Christians and Druze - join up every year.

Their numbers have grown rather than decreased since the controversial military assault on Gaza.


When I was in the army, they said it would be easy for me to get the job. I applied for a lot of things but it wasn't easy

Maher, Bedouin recruit
The Israeli military official responsible for minorities is Col Ahmed Ramiz.

He is Druze, another Arabic-speaking ethnic group with a presence in Israel and other parts of the Middle East.

He told me that the main obligation for any citizen of Israel "is to defend his country and to serve in the IDF".

How does this square with Israel's status as the world's only Jewish state? Why should Muslims apply - and why should Israel accept them? He explained the compromise in the following terms.

"We have decided that, due to the potential conflict between the Muslim person's national identities and their status as Israelis, we don't make it compulsory for Muslims to join the IDF," Col Ramiz said.

Muslims could work in every unit of the army, even elite units, although a Bedouin recruit recently applied to join the pilot's course and was declined.

"He didn't meet the specific requirements and various personality tests," the colonel told me, and denied it was anything to do with his ethnicity or religion.

But the pride shown by someone like Maj Fallah is not shared by all Bedouin soldiers who have signed up to the Israeli military.

Many young Bedouin join up to better their prospects in terms of education and work rather than national pride. Some are also sensitive to the fact that among other Muslim Arab communities military service is seen as a badge of shame.

Accused of treachery

Maher is a part-time physical education teacher in his 20s, who served in the military in the Education Unit.

"When I was in the army, they said it would be easy for me to get a job. I applied for a lot of things but it wasn't easy," Maher told me when I met him on the family farm near Nazareth.

"Muslim employers don't want me because I had been in the army and the Jews prefer to give jobs to other Jews," he explained.

"In my village it can be difficult but people are not hostile as in other places."

One of those places is the nearby town of Um al-Fahm, whose residents, like the Bedouin, are considered Israeli Arabs, but who continue to have close ties with the wider Palestinian community in the occupied territories and the post-1948 diaspora.

Such people make up the majority of Israel's 1.5 million non-Jewish Arab community, with the Bedouin accounting for less than 200,000 of that number.

Maher tells me he tries to avoid wearing his uniform in the non-Bedouin Arab villages to avoid being called a traitor and risking verbal and physical abuse.

Maher and other young serving Bedouin soldiers have described to me a feeling of being trapped.

On the one hand, they have to do military service, or non-military community service, to be eligible for government help towards education fees or for family allowances, on the other they run the risk of marginalisation from other non-Jews.

As Maher put it: "We are damned if we serve, and we are damned if we don't serve."

vir- BBC NEWS

[1knap]

20 Basic facts about the Zionist Regime of Israel Regarding The Palestine Problem:



THAT, when the Palestine Problem was created by Britain in 1917, more than 90% of the population of Palestine were Arabs?... And that there were at that time no more than 56,000 Jews in Palestine?

THAT, more than half of the Jews living in Palestine at that time were recent immigrants, who had come to Palestine in the preceding decades in order to escape persecution in Europe?... And that less than 5% of the population of Palestine were native Palestinian Jews?

THAT, the Arabs of Palestine at that time owned 97.5% of the land, while Jews (native Palestinians and recent immigrants together) owned only 2.5% of the land?

THAT, during the thirty years of British occupation and rule, the Zionists were able to purchase only 3.5% of the land of Palestine, in spite of the encouragement of the British Government?... And that much of this land was transferred to Zionist bodies by the British Government directly, and was not sold by Arab owners?

THAT, therefore, when British passed the Palestine Problem to the United Nations in 1947, Zionists owned no more than 6% of the total land area of Palestine?

THAT, notwithstanding these facts, the General Assembly of the United Nations recommended that a "Jewish State" be established in Palestine?... And that the Assembly granted that proposed "State" about 54% of the total area of the country?

THAT, Israel immediately occupied (and still occupies) 80.48% of the total land area of Palestine?

THAT, this territorial expansion took place, for the most part, before 15 May 1948: i.e., before the formal end of the British forces from Palestine, before the entry of Arab armies to protect Palestinian Arabs, and before the the Arab-Israeli war?

THAT, the 1947 recommendation of the General Assembly in favor of the creation of a "Jewish State" was outside the competence of the Assembly under the Charter of the United Nations?

THAT, all attempts by the Arab States and other Asian countries to have the Assembly submit the question of "constitutionality" of its recommendation to the International Court of Justice for an "advisory opinion" by the Court were rejected or ignored by the Assembly?

THAT, when the Assembly began to experience "second thoughts" over the matter and convened for its second special session in 1948, it failed to reaffirm the 1947 recommendation for the partition of Palestine-thus destroying whatever dubious legality that recommendation for the establishment of a "Jewish State" had had?

THAT, that original 1947 recommendation to create a "Jewish State" in Palestine was approved, at the first vote, only by European, American and Australian States...for every Asian State, and every African State (with the exception of the Union of South Africa) voted against it?...And that, when the vote was cast in plenary session on 29 November 1947, urgent American pressures (which a member of the Truman cabinet described as "bordering onto scandal") had succeeded in prevailing only upon one African country (Liberia), both of which had special vulnerability to American pressures, to abandon their declared opposition?...And that, in other words, the "Jewish State" was planted at the point-of-intersection of Asia and Africa without the free approval of any Middle Eastern, Asian or African country except that Union of South Africa, itself ruled by an alien minority?

THAT, Israel remained, ever since its inception, a total stranger in the emerging world of Afro-Asia; and that Israel has been refused admission to any inter-state conference of Asian, African, Afro-Asian, or Non-Aligned States ever held?

THAT, since the General Armistice Agreements were signed in 1949, Israel has maintained an aggressive policy of waging military attacks across the Armistice Demarcation Lines, repeatedly invading the territories of the neighboring Arab States...And that Israel has been duly rebuked, censured, or condemned for these military attacks by the Security Council of the General Assembly of the United Nations on eleven occasions-five times by the Security Council and six times by the General Assembly?

THAT, no other country in the world, whether member of the United Nations or non-member, has been so frequently condemned by the United Nations?

THAT, no Arab State has ever been condemned by any organ of the United Nations for military attacks upon Israel( or any other State)?

THAT, besides expelling the bulk of the Arab inhabitants of Palestine, and besides constantly attacking the neighboring Arab States, Israel has also consistently harassed the United Nations observers and other personnel stationed along the Armistice Demarcation Lines: It has assassinated the first United Nations Mediator and his military aide; it has detained some truce observers; it has military occupied and illegally searched the Headquarters of United Nations personnel; and it has boycotted meetings of the Mixed Armistice Commissions?...

THAT, Israel has additionally imposed a system of apartheid upon the Arabs who stayed in their homeland?...More than 90% of these Arabs live in "security zones;" they alone live under martial law, restricting their freedom to travel from village to village or from town to town; their children are denied equal opportunities for education; and they are denied decent opportunities for work, and the right to receive "equal pay for equal work?"

THAT, notwithstanding the foregoing facts, Israel has always been, and still is, widely portrayed in the Western press as the "bastion of democracy" and the "champion of peace" in the Middle East?

THAT, the Western Powers have persisted in declaring their determination to ensure a so-called "arms balance" in the area, as between Israel, on the one hand, and the one-hundred million inhabitants of the thirteen Arab States, on the other hand?... And this unilateral Western doctrine of so-called "arms balance" is no more reasonable than the suggestion that, in the Cuba-U.S.A conflict, there should be "arms balance" as between Cuba and the United States... or that the whole Continent of Africa should not be allowed to acquire more arms than South Africa... or that Mainland China should not be permitted to have more arms than Taiwan... or that the military allowed to acquire more arms than South Africa... and that only thus can peace be safeguarded in the Western Hemisphere, in Africa, in Asia, or in Europe?...

[behemoth]

Objavil-a 1knap

20 Basic facts about the Zionist Regime of Israel Regarding The Palestine Problem:



THAT, when the Palestine Problem was created by Britain in 1917, more than 90% of the population of Palestine were Arabs?... And that there were at that time no more than 56,000 Jews in Palestine?

THAT, more than half of the Jews living in Palestine at that time were recent immigrants, who had come to Palestine in the preceding decades in order to escape persecution in Europe?... And that less than 5% of the population of Palestine were native Palestinian Jews?

THAT, the Arabs of Palestine at that time owned 97.5% of the land, while Jews (native Palestinians and recent immigrants together) owned only 2.5% of the land?

THAT, during the thirty years of British occupation and rule, the Zionists were able to purchase only 3.5% of the land of Palestine, in spite of the encouragement of the British Government?... And that much of this land was transferred to Zionist bodies by the British Government directly, and was not sold by Arab owners?

THAT, therefore, when British passed the Palestine Problem to the United Nations in 1947, Zionists owned no more than 6% of the total land area of Palestine?

THAT, notwithstanding these facts, the General Assembly of the United Nations recommended that a "Jewish State" be established in Palestine?... And that the Assembly granted that proposed "State" about 54% of the total area of the country?

THAT, Israel immediately occupied (and still occupies) 80.48% of the total land area of Palestine?

THAT, this territorial expansion took place, for the most part, before 15 May 1948: i.e., before the formal end of the British forces from Palestine, before the entry of Arab armies to protect Palestinian Arabs, and before the the Arab-Israeli war?

THAT, the 1947 recommendation of the General Assembly in favor of the creation of a "Jewish State" was outside the competence of the Assembly under the Charter of the United Nations?

THAT, all attempts by the Arab States and other Asian countries to have the Assembly submit the question of "constitutionality" of its recommendation to the International Court of Justice for an "advisory opinion" by the Court were rejected or ignored by the Assembly?

THAT, when the Assembly began to experience "second thoughts" over the matter and convened for its second special session in 1948, it failed to reaffirm the 1947 recommendation for the partition of Palestine-thus destroying whatever dubious legality that recommendation for the establishment of a "Jewish State" had had?

THAT, that original 1947 recommendation to create a "Jewish State" in Palestine was approved, at the first vote, only by European, American and Australian States...for every Asian State, and every African State (with the exception of the Union of South Africa) voted against it?...And that, when the vote was cast in plenary session on 29 November 1947, urgent American pressures (which a member of the Truman cabinet described as "bordering onto scandal") had succeeded in prevailing only upon one African country (Liberia), both of which had special vulnerability to American pressures, to abandon their declared opposition?...And that, in other words, the "Jewish State" was planted at the point-of-intersection of Asia and Africa without the free approval of any Middle Eastern, Asian or African country except that Union of South Africa, itself ruled by an alien minority?

THAT, Israel remained, ever since its inception, a total stranger in the emerging world of Afro-Asia; and that Israel has been refused admission to any inter-state conference of Asian, African, Afro-Asian, or Non-Aligned States ever held?

THAT, since the General Armistice Agreements were signed in 1949, Israel has maintained an aggressive policy of waging military attacks across the Armistice Demarcation Lines, repeatedly invading the territories of the neighboring Arab States...And that Israel has been duly rebuked, censured, or condemned for these military attacks by the Security Council of the General Assembly of the United Nations on eleven occasions-five times by the Security Council and six times by the General Assembly?

THAT, no other country in the world, whether member of the United Nations or non-member, has been so frequently condemned by the United Nations?

THAT, no Arab State has ever been condemned by any organ of the United Nations for military attacks upon Israel( or any other State)?

THAT, besides expelling the bulk of the Arab inhabitants of Palestine, and besides constantly attacking the neighboring Arab States, Israel has also consistently harassed the United Nations observers and other personnel stationed along the Armistice Demarcation Lines: It has assassinated the first United Nations Mediator and his military aide; it has detained some truce observers; it has military occupied and illegally searched the Headquarters of United Nations personnel; and it has boycotted meetings of the Mixed Armistice Commissions?...

THAT, Israel has additionally imposed a system of apartheid upon the Arabs who stayed in their homeland?...More than 90% of these Arabs live in "security zones;" they alone live under martial law, restricting their freedom to travel from village to village or from town to town; their children are denied equal opportunities for education; and they are denied decent opportunities for work, and the right to receive "equal pay for equal work?"

THAT, notwithstanding the foregoing facts, Israel has always been, and still is, widely portrayed in the Western press as the "bastion of democracy" and the "champion of peace" in the Middle East?

THAT, the Western Powers have persisted in declaring their determination to ensure a so-called "arms balance" in the area, as between Israel, on the one hand, and the one-hundred million inhabitants of the thirteen Arab States, on the other hand?... And this unilateral Western doctrine of so-called "arms balance" is no more reasonable than the suggestion that, in the Cuba-U.S.A conflict, there should be "arms balance" as between Cuba and the United States... or that the whole Continent of Africa should not be allowed to acquire more arms than South Africa... or that Mainland China should not be permitted to have more arms than Taiwan... or that the military allowed to acquire more arms than South Africa... and that only thus can peace be safeguarded in the Western Hemisphere, in Africa, in Asia, or in Europe?...

1.Preveri podatke in ne kopiraj le muslimanske (palestinske) propagande.

2.Kaj pa sploh tebe žene, da se zaletavaš v državo in prebivalce, ki so ti tuji in ti niso nikoli naredili nič hudega? Pojdi tja, živi tam in potem si vzemi še čas, da prebereš kakšno knjigo o zgodovini Judov, morda Sveto pismo, Tanah.
Kaj pa vem, mogoče boš še vedno kopiral in zagovarjal enake reči, le z vestjo bi lahko imel pri tem probleme. Ob predpostavki, da.....

oprosti

[Barak]

Objavil-a behemoth

2.Kaj pa sploh tebe žene, da se zaletavaš v državo in prebivalce, ki so ti tuji in ti niso nikoli naredili nič hudega? Pojdi tja, živi tam in potem si vzemi še čas, da prebereš kakšno knjigo o zgodovini Judov, morda Sveto pismo, Tanah.
Kaj pa vem, mogoče boš še vedno kopiral in zagovarjal enake reči, le z vestjo bi lahko imel pri tem probleme. Ob predpostavki, da.....

oprosti

Zadeve si razlagaš napačno, če govoriva o dotični osebi oz. dotičnih prebivalcih neke državne mentalitete pač gre za nek unikum. Ne gre za rasno sovraštvo, ne gre za religijsko (čeravno se v zanosu njihovih čustev morda tako tud razume) ampak za t.i. slovanski patriotizem oz. ostanki blokovske delitve, ki ga zelo doživeto doživlja predvsem mladina, ki je rojena ob koncu oz. po koncu te ere.. Izrael je na strani ZDA, judje so skupina ki Ivanu Groznemu- Putinu, kot opozicija delajo nemalo težav, slo-"liberalci" (nasledniki socialistično-komunistične ideje) jih razumejo kot sinonim kapilizma in tako dalje. Srbin je dober ker je proruski in ker so tako fantastično sestrelili f-117 (knap samo zate), medtem ko so npr. Poljaki za njih enak poden kot judje, ker so obrnili hrbet mati Rusiji in se spečali z ameri, ki so za njih sinonim zla. To so ostanki neuvrščenih, kjer je v neformalnem prosovjetskem gibanju bili tako Arabci kot ex. yu. In v sovpregi z izobraževalnim sistemom-predvsem družboslovnim kjer so se svoje obrti izučili razni Videmski, Valenčiči itd.!!!

[1knap]

Objavil-a Barak

Zadeve si razlagaš napačno, če govoriva o dotični osebi oz. dotičnih prebivalcih neke državne mentalitete pač gre za nek unikum. Ne gre za rasno sovraštvo, ne gre za religijsko (čeravno se v zanosu njihovih čustev morda tako tud razume) ampak za t.i. slovanski patriotizem oz. ostanki blokovske delitve, ki ga zelo doživeto doživlja predvsem mladina, ki je rojena ob koncu oz. po koncu te ere.. Izrael je na strani ZDA, judje so skupina ki Ivanu Groznemu- Putinu, kot opozicija delajo nemalo težav, slo-"liberalci" (nasledniki socialistično-komunistične ideje) jih razumejo kot sinonim kapilizma in tako dalje. Srbin je dober ker je proruski in ker so tako fantastično sestrelili f-117 (knap samo zate), medtem ko so npr. Poljaki za njih enak poden kot judje, ker so obrnili hrbet mati Rusiji in se spečali z ameri, ki so za njih sinonim zla. To so ostanki neuvrščenih, kjer je v neformalnem prosovjetskem gibanju bili tako Arabci kot ex. yu. In v sovpregi z izobraževalnim sistemom-predvsem družboslovnim kjer so se svoje obrti izučili razni Videmski, Valenčiči itd.!!!

Mati Rusija bo šele razčistila ozadje Stalinovega holokavsta nad Rusi in Rusko inteligenco. Ve se kateri naciji so pripadali šefi represivnega aparata in kateri naciji so pripadali vsi partijski ideologi... kazen za zločine proti Rusom bo zelo, zelo grenka.
Če si mislil, da je lahko nek v Gruziji rojen šahist opozicija v Rusiji si se zmotil on bebec je le predstavnik za stike z mednarodno javnostjo nekega "Londončana"...

Rusija bo pisala zgodovino na novo in marsikoga bo zato hudo pekla glava...

[bing1]

Fanje, vidim, da ste se na veliko razpisali o Izraelu. Po pravici povedano nisem bral vseh 13 strani, vendar se tudi jaz pridružujem mnenju, da je z Izraelom, kot državo nekaj zelo narobe.
1. Temelj države je sveta knjiga, kjer je bog Izraelcem dal to deželo. Pomagal jim je pregnati prejšnje prebivalce.
2. Rimljani so čez nekaj 100 ali 1000 let poterali te nesrečne prebivalce iz te dežele. Raztepli so se po svetu in sanjarili o svoji državi.
3. Po drugi svetovni vojni, natančneje v letu 1948 je bila mitološki san uresničen. Malo bolj natančno so predhodniki opisali nastanek države.
Zdaj pa k bistvu problema:
- Država v bistvu bazira na verski pripadnosti. Če si židovske vere se lahko priseliš.
- Arabci, oziroma nežidovsko prebivalstvo so grobo rečeno drugo razredno prebivalstvo, kljub tako imenovani parlamentarni demokraciji.
- Država Izrael je odgovorna za pravično rešitev Palestinskega vprašanja. Izraelska država je superiorna glede na Palestinsko upravo in kljub enačenju Palestincev s terorosti (morda so tudi res), je država pravično in poštena dolžna poiskati ustrezno rešitev.
Izrael to očitno ni sposoben. Jemilitatntna država, katera se bo vedno čutila ogroženo, saj je vojska eden od bistvenih temeljev te države. Vsi vidni politi prihajajo iz vojske ali tajne obeščevalne službe. Po vsej verjetnosti na Izraelski strani ni nobenega resnega interesa za ureditev teh problemov, saj bi v nasprotnem primeru vojska izgubila vpliv na državo. Tako menim, da je odgovornost Izraela z vsemi državnimi inštitucijami, večja od Palestinske uprave za rešitev tega problema.